Views on America and N. Korea (1)

Mr. Bachrach asked a few questions about Korean perceptions a little while back, and having gotten a chance to talk to some Korean university students and soldiers, I thought I'd post some preliminary results.

What do South Koreans think of the North Korean government?
They don't seem to like it much, but they also don't seem to perceive it as much of a threat to them. It's an unfortunate part of reality, but not one they see changing any time soon. I asked if the recent talks/results of their president's meeting with Kim Jung Il changed that at all, but they didn't seem to feel that it did. They don't see it as changing much about the situation.

What do they think of the US Government?
They don't seem to understand why we re-elected Bush. He's not popular here, and they don't seem to like American policy. They don't seem to think there was much point to the Iraqi war, and aren't thrilled that they're helping us out in Afghanistan, either, though they don't really harbor resentment against Americans in general.

They know who Barack Obama is, and Hillary Clinton, and Giuliani, and can recognize their faces. They don't know too much about their respective positions, and claim they don't have a preference on who wins the American elections ("We'll care a few months later, once they start doing things"), but they're certainly following the elections ("I'm just not sure Obama has enough experience...") and know their ways around American politics. I've even had a few who could listen to me mentioning states I've lived in/been to/family is in, and point out "Huh...all blue states" without my mentioning anything about politics.

As a whole they seem well-aware of what's going on in America, and the issues that are being tossed around. Given how much they seem to know about and how much they care about what policies or activities occur, I find I almost feel bad towards the end of the conversations that they can't vote in American elections - they know more than half of American voters, and definitely have interests in who America chooses as leadership. Whereas we pay little to no attention to their elections, leadership, issues, or politics. As one of them said when I mentioned this, "When we elect a president, we elect the president of Korea. When you elect a president, you elect the president of the world."

That said, these are the best and brightest of Korea - I have no idea how representative they are of Koreans as a whole. And given that older Koreans are substantially more socially conservative than the US, maybe I wouldn't want to see them voting. Still, it doesn't seem entirely democratic that officials only Americans can elect have such broad powers and influence over the entire world.

Do they think the US should continue to keep military forces in their country?
Tricky question, they say. Ultimately, they think it's an issue that's easy to gripe about and bemoan, but they don't think most Koreans want the American military gone. Politicians here may say things like that for popularity, but they think most Koreans recognize that American forces are a huge safety net for them.

The ones who have already served their 2 years in the military have no issues at all with American troops, and many trained under Americans and got to know a lot of them. They say the Korean military has no problem with the American military presence. They say that the main group that wants the American military gone is, in fact, the American military - Koreans as a whole don't mind its presence here.

What are the prospects for reunification?
They seem a bit disillusioned with that. Even with all of the recent developments with North Korea, at the 6-party talks and their own president's meeting with Kim Jung Il, along with all of the promises and agreements that came from those, they don't seem to think the chances of unification are very large. To be honest, they don't seem to think anything will change much from the current relationship.

Additionally, the youth seem not to care. According to one of my professors, schools used to enforce and teach that the North are Koreans, and that unification was inevitable and going to be a great and wondrous thing, and is something to strive for. Recent surveys have somewhat surprised the older generations in that the younger generation says they don't particularly care if they unite with the North again or not. So older Koreans are probably still thinking unification is great, and that it will happen someday. The younger generations (presumably because they never knew relatives or siblings in the North) increasingly don't care.


That's as much as I've been told right now - I'll keep asking around when I get the chance, and hopefully will find some older Koreans I can get the opinions of as well.

연고전 (Yongochon)

Well yesterday was interesting. Yonsei University (where I'm at) and Korea University are something of rival schools, ranking 2nd and 3rd in the country (which one's which switches around).

They have a competition once per year, where over the course of two days they compete against one another in 5 sports (Rugby, Soccer, Basketball, Baseball, Ice Hockey?). I didn't really know where/when these were taking place and things have been somewhat busy, so I didn't have much intention of going (how different could they be from American university sports?), but after a meeting with an economics club I joined here, some students offered to take me along since they were going. This economics club is from all three top universities, so the members I actually ended up going with were from Korea University.

It turns out there were some differences. All kids from both schools don school colors (Yonsei=blue, Korea=red) and go to do cheers for their teams at the events - the cheers are half the point, I don't think most of them care about the sports. But they all do cheers in unison, which is kind of cool to see when you have 5,000 kids from each school in the stands (they don't have room in their own school stadiums - the soccer match I went to see today was held in the Seoul Olympic stadium leftover from the 1988 olympics). So there are giant crowds from the two schools, partitioned into a red side and a blue side, each side doing their own chants and cheers in unison, with everyone in the stands participating, doing cheers for the whole game.

The cheer-leaders down on the field dress in half-Elvis half-traditional Korean dress, and dance and lead cheers which the occasional flames and fireworks going off around them.

There were a few other aspects that I noticed that distinguished them from American school rivalries/games, though they didn't seem to think much of:

1. During the cheering, one of the props is a bag - kind of like a grocery bag, except it's red, and they get it full of air then hold the end closed, and wave them around in unison to make noise and a visual spectacle. Except after the game ends, everyone takes their bag and starts picking up trash off the ground around them and filling the bag with it. They clean up after themselves at the stadium. Definitely not the American way.
2. It is, quite literally, all in good fun. There is no animosity between the kids from opposite schools - they may make a playful jab or comment about their school being better, but there's no bitterness or anger at all - even when one side beats the other (this year, one game was canceled, and Korea won 3 of the other 4, the last being a tie - no anger from Yonsei students at all). There aren't any fights that break out, there's no yelling in the faces of the opposing team, there's no catcalls or really mean things said...half the time they sync up and sing the same cheer together if there are two groups around one another after the game. Complete camaraderie. They help each other, share with each other, etc. The kids act as though they're from the same school.
3. After all of the events have ended, they all head back to the area around Yonsei University (Sinchon), where they organize by clubs or groups from each school, march around together in people-trains (one's hands on the next's shoulders), and chant and sing outside of restaurants for food/drink. And the restaurants, knowing this was coming, give them things. Krispy Kreme gave free donuts to everyone who did so, another place gave out free Soju shots (rice vodka, basically) and fried chicken, etc. You have to earn it though - the kids usually are out there chanting for 5-10 minutes per place before food comes out.
   
4. The games are free to go to (for anyone, not just students) and are sponsored by companies. The food that's given out (since feeding kids from two 40,000-student schools would bankrupt anyone) is paid for by alumni - if an alumnus happens to be eating at one of the places when a train of kids comes chanting, they often offer to personally pay for the round for that group.

So all in all a very strange day. The sport was a spectacle, and the fact that the kids cleaned up after themselves and got along so well despite the rivalry was really impressive. I was on the streets of Sinchon for a bit afterwards, and one group from Korea University had been chanting for 5 minutes outside of a restaurant. Along comes another line, this one from Yonsei University, and it turned out they're the same club (Student Ambassadors) from each school. They were thrilled, and started to do chants and march together.

So not quite the individualism you'd see in America, but also a lot more friendship betwixt students from the two schools. Very interesting time.

Naturally, my camera died after the first picture, but here's a YouTube clip of a sporting event from last year's. Clicking on some of the other video's it offers after this one ends shows other parts of the events.